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Subject: Velocitek SC-1
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George Perantinos
Posts:2

11/06/2007 5:49 AM  
I have been reading about these in various web sites for some time now and I've been thinking of getting one.
Specs: http://www.velocitek.us/product.php?p=sc1
Is there any consensus about the legality of these during racing?
Are there any boats using it during class racing and/or practicing?

Thanks,
George
Pierson Jacquelin
Posts:28

11/11/2007 2:13 PM  
I believe this device would be illegal during racing under Rule 8.1.5 which states that "the following practices are not permitted when racing:", "Use of Loran, GPS, or similar position fixing devices."

There has been some talk in the rules section of the forum about modifying or repealing this rule, which I would support to a degree. My belief is that GPS devices such as this are far more affordable than a through-hull speedo/fluxgate compass package ($1000 + headache of installation). Although I also support the concept that [i]only[/i] speed and heading information should be made available to the skipper and crew and [i]not[/i] a determination from the computer whether or not the boat is lifted or headed--that should come from the computer in our heads. If the GPS floodgates are opened, I could see a fully wired cyber-tactician position hunched over a laptop developing (a la America's Cup) very quickly.

-Pierson
Slippery When Wet, US21859
Alister Morison
Posts:12

07/30/2008 12:25 AM  
The Velocitek SC-1 is unlikely to be legal as it allows for postion fixing in relation to the Start line.  Velocitek did have another model, the Velocitek S10 which is a legal device if the rules are read correctly - The S10 can not be used as a Position Fixing Device.  The give away is the fact that Loran and GPS or similar is used in the wording.
 

Elaine Ryan
Posts:1

08/07/2008 5:17 PM  
 

There has been some debate over whether or not the Velocitek SC-1 is legal in the J/24 class. There are two relevant ISAF J/24 class rules sections:

 

6 OPTIONAL EQUIPMENT

6.1 The following are permitted when racing:

6.1.9 Electronic devices to record, measure and calculate average speed, and to indicate distance and

water depth.

 

8 RESTRICTIONS WHEN RACING

8.1 The following practices are not permitted when racing:

8.1.5 Use of Loran, GPS, or similar position fixing devices.

 

The SC-1 is therefore allowed if it is programmed as a simple speedometer and compass. The SC-1 can also function as a position-fixing device (start line proximity mode), but this capability can be disabled, making the device legal for racing in the J/24 class.

 

The firmware that the SC-1 comes with out of the box (basic firmware)  does not have the start line proximity mode. All the device is capable of showing is speed and direction.

 

When the device is turned on and you hit the "Mode" button, nothing happens. Right out of the box the device does not offer the start line proximity, VMG and Timer modes.

 

The start line proximity mode is available to users who download the full firmware from the Velocitek website for free. This mode is easily disabled and in the event of any protests, race committee members can easily check that a device does not have the start line proximity mode enabled (see below).  In order to re-enable the start line proximity mode one needs to open the device's waterproof enclosure and plug the device into a computer.

 

Below is an explanation of how to download the full firmware, how to disable specific modes, including start line proximity, and how to tell which modes are currently installed on the device.

 

Users have the option of downloading the advanced (full) firmware from the Velocitek website by going to: http://www.velocitek.com/downloads/gen2_3.php and downloading Velocitek Control Center 2.3. There, they can download firmware that includes the start line proximity, VMG and timer modes as well as speed and compass.

 

You can tell if the user has downloaded the full firmware with these capabilities by turning on their unit and pressing the Mode button. Each time the Mode button is pressed a new capability is shown (speed, compass, VMG, timer).When you press the Mode button one of the options will be the start line proximity mode but the start line proximity mode has no mode indicator;  when the "mode" button is pressed, you just see numbers, no label.  You can tell that this mode is in use because it is the only mode with no label. All of the other modes have labels. 

 

The only information that race committee members need to know is:

  1. If nothing happens when you press the Mode button, the SC-1 is in basic mode and is only capable of acting as a speedometer and compass.
  2. If the SC-1 is in advanced mode (full firmware has been installed) and the start line proximity mode has been disabled (making the device legal), when you press the Mode button all of the modes available on the unit will have a label (mode indicator).

 

To disable the start line proximity mode:

  1. Open Velocitek Control Center 2.3 
  2. Plug your SC-1 into your computer using a USB cord.
  3. Click Devices and highlight your device (see the demo video if you need clarification)
  4. Click Device Settings
  5. Uncheck the box that says "start line proximity"

 

Velocitek technical support can be contacted by phone or by email.


Elaine Ryan

Sales and Support Manager


Velocitek - Performance Training Tools

Web: velocitek.com

Toll free USA & Canada: 1-800-693-0659

International: +1-(650)-362-0499

Fax: +1-(650)-618-2679  271B Kahiko Street, Paia, HI, 96779, USA

Peter Stevens
Posts:32

08/17/2008 6:31 AM  

NEWS - from the ITC

 

VELOCITEK SC-1 DISCUSSIONS

The information so far on the Velocitek SC-1 used in basic mode is that it conforms with the J/24 class rules. Some of the advanced features violate some class rules.

The relevant class rules are 4.1.3 and 8.1.5.

The SC-1 does not break any class rules if it records GPS tracks that are later downloaded to a computer and displayed there. It cannot be used to display position or VMG during a race.

4.1.3 A minimum of one fixed marine type compass of magnetic card or digital readout type capable only of instantaneous readout. (Compasses capable of displaying stored headings and/or performing calculations for storage of tactical information shall be not allowed.)

8.1.5 Use of Loran, GPS, or similar position fixing devices.

As these continue to evolve and the price point drops, it is something the class should revisit.  The J24 Association would welcome any input on the issue.

 

Ken Shores
Posts:41

08/31/2008 11:00 PM  
I didn't think that anyone had responded to my question. But it seems that I was wrong, and that there was quite a bit of talk. While can see what the International Rules Committee is attempting to do, it doesn't seem to make much sense. Pandora is already out of the box, and as long as the data for the GPS what ever name or model used can input to some pc with number calculation ability then there you go.... There will still be the human element making the decision based on the data.

Remember we sent men to the moon using slide rules...

Thanks to everyone for their comments, I enjoyed the discussion.

From the Gulf Coast, the home of oil refining and huricanes,

Ken Shores
USA 2273

Lorne Chapman
Posts:149

09/30/2008 1:34 PM  
To clarify - the post below from Peter Stevens is not from the ITC as Pete is not a member. However Pete has been an active contributor to off-forum discussions on this issue and, in good spirit, passed on some information that describes where we are with respect to the existing class rules. There is nothing inaccurate in what he has said - just some enthusiasm to help get a question answered. This is an active topic in the ITC and will be discussed at the upcoming World Council meeting. Stay tuned. Lorne Chapman Chairman, ITC
Ben Mack
Posts:4

11/03/2008 11:59 PM  
I have been using a Velocitek SC1 this summer on the SF Bay and I like it.  It is really important to note that for $400 with this unit you have a indicator which can give you feedback on speed AND a compass with a decent sized readout, not to mention all of the other VMG, startline functions, etc.  For people (like me) that have older beat up J24s with a barely visable compass, this is a great value.  
Alister Morison
Posts:12

11/04/2008 3:01 AM  
The Velocitek SCI is not legal in class racing unless it is used in Basic mode - refer above - and it is very useful for producing GPS tracks for post race analysis using programs like GPSAR or a new one TCREPLAY.
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